Community Input - PvE, it's rewards and incentives

BioXide

Founder

Staff member
Lead Developer
Management
Jun 1, 2017
457
Portland, Oregon
Guns of the Conclave
Rank: Princeps (R7)
Service Points: 999999
Here's another community input thread, in this one I'm interested in seeing the community's opinion on pve content, my personal biased goals with pve are the following:

- pve should be fun, engaging & challenging, you should always have access to pve

- it should be tied to the pvp aspect of the game and "progression" of the factions, in order to get the best gear, factions need to move further away from earth and into dangerous worlds to gather rare minerals and control services

- the "best" equipment can only be produced by high end minerals, which are only gathered from these dangerous locations filled with difficult pve, this creates a situation where players will be required to work together in order to produce the highest quality items and always keeps a sense of risk associated with eco, you shouldn't be able to gather the best minerals without a risk/challenge, this gives equipment weight and meaning, because you know the work that was put into producing it

- most combat oriented players do not like ecoing/crafting and they shouldn't be forced to do so, you should be able to log in and always have something to shoot and be able to "progress" while doing so

- pve won't give the players equipment, every single wearable item in the game is produced 100% by players, AI will only drop production materials which can be used for alternative recipes or specific items, this way combat oriented players can "eco" by killing stuff, AI will also drop cash shop items (very rare drops), to at least have something to break the loot monotony

- daily capped payouts, killing AI rewards the players with money till they reach the daily cap, this allows players to "print" money, alongside daily missions (players will be able to earn x amount of money per day, by killing AI and doing all daily missions, without the need of other players, even if the game has 0 players online, you should be able to log in and get rewarded for doing stuff, by keeping players engaged for 1-2 hours daily, this increases the log'd in time of players, which results in more player interactions/conflict)

- there needs to be a sense of progression with pve, that doesn't break the mantra of the game, which is that you're able to start playing the game and have access to every item in the game without any time restrictions or stat progression, a newbie and a veteran will always be on the same playing field, what changes is the social, skill & wealth progression (ex: an experienced combat player with average equipment killing someone less skilled with the "best" equipment and being able to wear all his equipment without any restrictions)

- for pve "progression", I thought of having some sort of stat tracking, "experience points", that shows how much AI you've killed and any other relevant stats, the "achievement" and how other players perceive these stats is up to them (ex: when hiring someone for protection, you should be able to see their stats, kinda like a portfolio/resume, how you interpret that, again, it's up to the players, ex: not hiring a player for "end-game" mining because he hasn't killing enemies on that world) a player who's killed 1000 aliens won't have a mechanical advantage over one who's killed 10, it's how players perceive you

- "raids and dungeons" there should be some end-game pve activities that are extremely challenging and require groups of experienced players to complete, these activities should reward high end materials to gain an economic advantage over your enemies, factions should fight over control of these spots (ex: hunting behemoths, alien cave in fom, except with rewards that are meaningful)

I strongly believe that the PvE aspects of the game should be strong and overlap seamlessly with the pvp/player interaction focused nature of the game, both elements need to support each other without tipping the scale, in order to create an engaging game that always has content available and how players approach this given content, creates more dynamic "player focused" content (ex: creating a mining expedition on a far world, players working together to clear the area from AI in order to gather resources, and then another group shows up, will they work together? will it turn into a fight over who gets control of resources? that's up to the players)

Those are my thoughts, regarding pve content, coming from a player's perspective and a developer one, I'm interested in seeing what the community thinks about pve content, nothing is set in stone, so let's discuss and pool our thoughts to achieve the best outcome.
 
Last edited:

Tod Maddux

Enthusiast

Bronzed Donator
Alpha Tester
Jun 30, 2017
252
Civil Protection Commission
Rank: None
Service Points: 0
So lootboxes confirmed? How much will the keys cost?
 
Jul 10, 2017
23
NYC
The Syndicate
Rank: None
Service Points: 0
PvE in old FoM was honestly some of the most fun i've had and i like the direction you're thinking of going with it.

i think there are tons of way to make it better while keeping the same combat system we have now. in terms of the actual mechanics, one of the turnoffs of pve was the fact that there was no way to "dodge" an alien attack, it just ran up to you and started humping your leg and doing damage and all you could really do was run. to give players more of a fair fight i'd like to see a mechanic that shows an attack indicator for the alien, and different attacks for different aliens.

so for example, if an alien only has one attack that damages an area equivalent to a cone in front of it, put an indicator on the ground of that cone so that players have an opportunity to dodge. while it's green the alien can still move and aim it's attack, yellow: it stops and locks in, red: the attack. easy aliens could have one easy, predictable attack, while more difficult group raid aliens could have a variety of different attacks, with a larger radius, aimed at multiple groups of people.

also having well defined "zones" (either by foliage or just plain ol' signs) for where people should go based on how big their group/skill level is. easy aliens that only aggro if you aggro them at the starter areas, moderate aliens that aggro you in intermediate areas that a seasoned person could kill alone or two/three inexperienced could kill, and harder areas with the group raid monsters.

when it comes to tracking a players achievements, a kill count for the difficult/type of alien could do. i also like the idea of having these "high risk" planets be associated with high eco rewards, incentivizing people to actually kill aliens.

those are my two cents, i think rethinking the gameplay mechanics for pve is key because no one liked dealing with rapespiders alone.
 
Dec 6, 2017
1
Vancouver, Canada
No Faction
Rank: None
Service Points: 0
a player who's killed 1000 aliens won't have a mechanical advantage over one who's killed 10, it's how players perceive you
A sheer number might not cut it if theres a range of difficulty. Some goof could grind easy aliens all day and look better than those who killed difficult ones.
 

Banjo

Dilettante

Bronzed Donator
Alpha Tester
Jun 14, 2017
122
Terran Defense Corps
Rank: None
Service Points: 0
Pve thread in a game that's the spiritual successor to the worlds most promising racing game... I'm very disappointed.
 

Ferin

Dilettante

Supporting Donator
Jun 17, 2017
133
Terran Defense Corps
Rank: None
Service Points: 0
Can you actually make PvE dynamically engaging so that it challenges new and old players?
If not then you'll just have to accept its going to be boring grind for resources.
 

Shakespears

Game Writer

Staff member
Bronzed Donator
Alpha Tester
Jun 14, 2017
751
Virginia, USA
Civil Protection Commission
Rank: Game Master
Service Points: 0
Can you actually make PvE dynamically engaging so that it challenges new and old players?
If not then you'll just have to accept its going to be boring grind for resources.
Also can the NPCs not be janky, have a decent ability to not be cheesed by tiny ledges, or have weird aggro/deaggro zones?
 

BioXide

Founder

Staff member
Lead Developer
Management
Jun 1, 2017
457
Portland, Oregon
Guns of the Conclave
Rank: Princeps (R7)
Service Points: 999999
PvE in old FoM was honestly some of the most fun i've had and i like the direction you're thinking of going with it.

i think there are tons of way to make it better while keeping the same combat system we have now. in terms of the actual mechanics, one of the turnoffs of pve was the fact that there was no way to "dodge" an alien attack, it just ran up to you and started humping your leg and doing damage and all you could really do was run. to give players more of a fair fight i'd like to see a mechanic that shows an attack indicator for the alien, and different attacks for different aliens.

so for example, if an alien only has one attack that damages an area equivalent to a cone in front of it, put an indicator on the ground of that cone so that players have an opportunity to dodge. while it's green the alien can still move and aim it's attack, yellow: it stops and locks in, red: the attack. easy aliens could have one easy, predictable attack, while more difficult group raid aliens could have a variety of different attacks, with a larger radius, aimed at multiple groups of people.

also having well defined "zones" (either by foliage or just plain ol' signs) for where people should go based on how big their group/skill level is. easy aliens that only aggro if you aggro them at the starter areas, moderate aliens that aggro you in intermediate areas that a seasoned person could kill alone or two/three inexperienced could kill, and harder areas with the group raid monsters.

when it comes to tracking a players achievements, a kill count for the difficult/type of alien could do. i also like the idea of having these "high risk" planets be associated with high eco rewards, incentivizing people to actually kill aliens.

those are my two cents, i think rethinking the gameplay mechanics for pve is key because no one liked dealing with rapespiders alone.
Alien attacks will be noticeable with animation cues, we won't have damage radius, attacks will be animation based, so if you see the alien swinging at you, at one point in the animation frames it will execute it's hit detection to see if it hit you or not.

We'll have different areas for alien hunting, ranging in different difficulties, aliens will also infect other colonies, if not controlled, a colony might become a very hostile and challenging area.

A sheer number might not cut it if theres a range of difficulty. Some goof could grind easy aliens all day and look better than those who killed difficult ones.
We'll have kill tracking for every type of enemy, not just an overall number, maybe we can branch out and have other stat tracking features to have some sort of progression that doesn't give any mechanical advantages over new players.

Can you actually make PvE dynamically engaging so that it challenges new and old players?
If not then you'll just have to accept its going to be boring grind for resources.
Of course, that's the plan, each AI will have different behavioral patterns, I want the pve to feel like Mass Effect, we'll be exploring different options of rewarding players for taking down the most challenging pve content in the game, these areas should feel like a raid in other MMOs.

Also can the NPCs not be janky, have a decent ability to not be cheesed by tiny ledges, or have weird aggro/deaggro zones?
This is not the fom engine lol, I'll do my best to make sure the AI can't be cheesed.
 

Hard Hat Harry

Helpful Citizen

Bronzed Donator
Alpha Tester
Sep 8, 2017
176
The Syndicate
Rank: None
Service Points: 0
So is bioterrorism going to be possible like in FoTD then? I like it overall, but a concern is everywhere can be overflowing with aliens if the game is inactive.
 

Skiy

Dilettante

Bronzed Donator
Alpha Tester
Jun 12, 2017
107
The Syndicate
Rank: None
Service Points: 2
So my thoughts on PvE are pretty simple. It can't be completely different from the rest of the game, but it shouldn't just be tacked on to the end and really relies on how far the Dev team are willing to take it. It should be possible to make it more complex and entertaining later on if players respond well to PvE content, but it should also be possible to play the game without firing a shot a drone or xeno once in your life.

If the devs are able and willing, I'd love to see the at least two types of enemy. Drone or Alien. More are cool but having two types with specific difference is, to me, a start in creating different content while it's part of a single aspect of the game. With different environments and resistances, meaning players will know what sort of engagement they'll be in if they plan beforehand and can react accordingly with different gear.

Rules should be fairly clear. If the idea for security drones is in the final version of the game. I'd like both them and things like "rogue" drones to react with similar behaviours with different types changing their routines. Like a "Haywire" Rogue Drone more likely to rush the player in an attempt to get in close. With Alien creatures I'd like to see different types or species which react ever so differently. If we were to go with a really complex approach (Not really recommending it.) then I'd go with having your species first, with all models looking like it's species and have specific actions. Using a FoM alien, the Behemoth, as an example. A specific action could be that if it's likely to try and escape when it reaches 25% HP, or it does a large swipe that players need to remember might happen at a specific point in the fight. Adding types would be another way to add more things to remember about a certain species. Perhaps you're fighting a little Basilisk and it's got bright red markings as opposed to dull red markings. Using nothing other than visual information, you might notice it's a lot more aggressive than others of the same species or it's stronger. Perhaps it's got a big crest on its head and you've fought a similar one before and last time you did, it retreated and called for help. If you go for a system without it blatantly saying "BASILISK [ALPHA < LOOK HERE THIS IS IMPORTANT]" when you mouse over, I think it'd reward players for paying attention to what they're doing.

I won't say players won't get bored of this. We will all get bored of doing something eventualy but if the details are small enough and can offer enough challenge, then it can be entertaining for a good while and encourages players, especially ones who purposely make a living off of protecting mining expeditions or just trips out to dangerous parts of the universe to really invest in learning what's around them. Also, can you imagine the surprise the first time a player encounters this sort of system? "Man, these Basilisks are so easy.. Huh that one looks cool.. OH SHIT WHY IS THERE 6 OF THEM ON ME?!" Surviving that creates stories without player interaction and while player interaction is very important, I want my character to be part of the world, not a plane ever so seperated from it.

Not only behaviours should be altered, but across species there should be certain things that follow the rules of the game. If we're giving bonus to damage to humans based on head shots, then this rule should also be applicable in PvE. Weakspots should be able to be exploited for bonus damage or other effects. They don't have to be the head, but knowing your enemy will seperate the vet hunters from the newbies. Some of them should be fairly obviously. Like the heads of certain aliens, while backplates or exhausts on drones would be their weak points. As long as it follows the rules of the game, this is, I think, a decent idea.

I'd also like to see a neutral organisation that offers contracts to all players, regardless of faction, an opportunity to earn cash from participating in PvE. I don't think mobs should drop cash by default. Why the hell does an alien in the middle of nowhere have cash on them that I can just take and spend back on Earth? That makes no sense. But harvesting materials from drops and being able to collect a bounty for the kills fits more with the rules of the game and makes sense to me. These contracts should be seperated by difficulty. Let's say it goes Easy - Normal - Hard- Extreme - Epic. The first four contract types are considered Solo/Group while Epic is considered Community.

I've got two ideas when it comes to the Solo/Group category and would depend on how grouping is done. First is that each contract is specific to the player. If you're solo you can accept the available "Kill 10 Basilisks" Contact but if you're wanting to do it with another player, they can accept their own "Kill 10 Basilisks" contract and you can both go off together to get your 10 kills. As long as you've done some damage to the creature you're hunting in a certain amount of time before it's death, it's considered your kill as well as the person who got the last shot. Meaning your group doesn't need a "party" system just to play together. However, that opens up speed running players through contracts to earn cash. You could end up taking easy contracts together and just have 10 players hit a basilisk once for easy cash.

So the second idea would be that you'd be able to accept a contract and invite X amount of players to participate. You could be able to set the payout type so it's equal, or based on something (like damage done perhaps?). I think that's the more complicated option but I'd much prefer it. Means that payouts would actually scale based on how many players you've taken with you for the hunt while giving incentives for players to take on harder contracts rather than spamming the Easy "hunt 10 mobs" contract.

Community based missions would be open contracts that I'm open to either having to be accepted or is just open and is unlike the other tiers. It's a community objective. Maybe it's a "world boss" (a significantly stronger enemy that might take a large group of players to defeat) or maybe it's a cull based objective and requires players to kill vast amounts of a certain type of critter. This, I feel, would also fulfill the idea for having raid/dungeons. It's also a way to drive more conflict. It provides an opportunity for players that perhaps might want to defend these "poor, misunderstood creatures" from being brutally slaughtered. Now you have two groups across factions that might be for or against the event, driving more conflict. (And you know if somebody can justify killing somebody else for a laugh, they'll probably take it if they're from this community ;) )

Players would be rewarded based on their contributions and based on whether they succeeded or not. Just numbers without working it out. But let's pretend that there's a 2,000,000 UC contract for killing 20,000 Basilisks in a day. If the players succeed, they get 2,000,000 split between the amount of players and how many they all killed. So If I contribute 5% of the kills, I'll get 100k for my efforts. But I don't want players being furious that they got 19,999 kills but because they didn't hit the target in the alotted time, they don't get paid at all (especially for kill based contracts rather than single mob contracts). So I would say that while the reward was up to 2 Mil, there's a bonus of 500k if players actually complete it. There's a drive for it but it's not the end of the world if you don't actually get there.

I'd also like to expand on the neutral organisation. Firstly I want to reiterate that these would be a NPC org that is pretty much automated. The only restriction I'd put on them is perhaps being under a certain amount of PP. Not so low that you kill a single person and you can't do anything until you get rid of it but enough that if you've gone on a ganking spree and ran out of money, you can't just go kill aliens for bounties so you carry on being a pain in the ass. You should be locked out of it until your PP is below the threshold. Then you can continue not only accepting, but finishing the contracts that were frozen beforehand when you hit that limit.

To address progression. I'd like to put forward the idea of having a trophy system and these trophies being used in a point system for purchasing PMODs or, if we go the cosmetic route, hunter specific cosmetics. If cosmetics, perhaps a skin system that that would allow players to have these permanent, marketable items, that they can apply to their items but would remain on the player when they die. (So, you can apply a skin to the armor piece, but when you die the skin leaves the item and goes back to your inventory and the armor you drop reverts to the standard type.)

If it's PMODs, skins can still be part of it (maybe it's just applied to the items and doesn't change no matter who is using it) but I was thinking more about progressing when it comes to PvE. I want to see veteran hunters awarded for their time and effort without new players feeling completely outclassed and useless.

Along side harvestable materials and bounty rewards for hunting, PMODs could offer another item that you could sell on the market. Either the end product or just the module itself. The player should gain "trophies" that they pick up when harvesting a mob. These trophies would be added to their stats, maybe a showable hunting card that shows the amount of trophies claimed from different mobs.

Example:
__________________________________________________________________________

[Hunting Card - Skiy]

Basilisk Trophies - x23 (7500) Rogue Drone Trophies - x0 (0
Behemoth Trophies - x1 (1) Rogue Sentry Trophies - x15 (90)

< >
__________________________________________________________________________

As you can see, they're divided into two numbers. One is the amount you currently have (and would only be available for you to see) while the other number is the total you've gained over your characters life time. The first number is used as currency, or with credits as well, to purchase PMODs while the second number is used to show other players what you've done with your time, or just so you can say "Shut up noob, I have 1 behemoth kill!".

The PMODs themselves I think should be focused on the PvE aspect. I think that weapons designed for killing players should be totally fine for killing mobs. However I do think that there should be specialised equipment for players that are only looking to hunt mobs. This equipment could still be used against players but would have slight penalities for human targets while giving small bonuses against the specific type of mob they're fighting.

Example. 9mm EM Ammo.

This ammo fits in a standard pistol (or whatever.) but has lower human damage output in exchange for higher damage output against machines. This not only means it's useful for Drone hunters but is sought after by factions who tend to run into the CPC and their security drones. To purchase, you'd need the correct trophy plus the UC (or no UC, I'm open to either.) and on purchase, your tokens will be reduced by the amount required in the first number slot while still showing all of your kills in the second.

Is this a well thought out suggestion? Not really, just a few ideas that I welcome criticism on. I have no intention of getting rid of Player v Player interaction but I feel very strongly against just having a PvE element of the game hastily tacked on to the end with no real meaning or reward.

And an additional thing. I greatly oppose limits or caps to prevent me from doing something I enjoy in the game. Why are you punishing me for participating in the content you've put in the game? If I have fun shooting NPCs instead of players, why is that a negative? By placing caps you give the impression that this is not about fun or having entertainment, this is a chore you need to complete every single day to get the most out of your time spent in the game. It is not a fun feature, it's a punishment for not playing the way you want me to. This should be avoided at all costs and the rewards should be balanced based on what players do every day. I shouldn't get 20k a day for killing a few aliens and then none at all for 24hours. You know what I'm going to do with that? I'm going to log on every day at a specific time, do my hunting and then either log off or go elsewhere. That's removing content, that's removing potential stories and situations for players to encounter.
 

Cathmor

Citizen

Bronzed Donator
Alpha Tester
Aug 6, 2017
55
No Faction
Rank: None
Service Points: 0
I can immediately say 1.) I agree, but 2.) I think what you've described is inherently counter intuitive to what you want to achieve.

I agree with: "pve should be fun, engaging & challenging, you should always have access to pve" and "it should be tied to the pvp aspect of the game and "progression" of the factions".

The way you describe your PVE mechanics though sounds like a retread of boring grind mechanics from other games. I'm going to assume you laid out the bare bones in the hopes to hash it out with us so that's where I'm going to give you my opinions.

What exactly do you mean by best equipment?

PVE as described is a means to obtain the highest end materials for the ability to create the highest end production. These areas that provide such materials are going to be PVP hot spots. Someone is going to end up with a majority control. Even if that control changes the entire player pool is never going to be in control if the space is limited. Inevitably, groups of players are going to be locked out of this high end production in at least a limited sense.

You say you don't want PVE to change the fact that players are always going to be on the same level but allowing only some players to have the best equipment compared to others sounds to me like the field isn't level. If your only metric of difference is something you can't quantify like "skill" this is bullshit to me.

I doubt that's what you mean. This needs clarification.

You want combat orientated players always having something to meaningfully shoot at for progress.

As a combat orientated player this is how I would view your PVE as described. I have to go to these areas which are more likely than others to have PVP occur which automatically makes them more dangerous than others to me.

As a combat orientated player I can obtain production materials? Why do I want those? If I want to farm materials to turn a profit on I'm not much of a combat focused player. At best I donate them to my faction or a producer I know. My interest levels are low.

I'm capped at getting 1-2 hours of money. How much money? Enough that it outweighs the PVP risk of losing my gear trying to get it? Let's say yes. After those 1-2 hours do I care about farming stats? Fuck no. The only stat that ever mattered was penalty points. I would more likely laugh at players that spent all their time farming PVE stats or achievements.

My ultimate perception is that I don't care about PVE. I'm just going to prey on the players that do and take their shit.

Raids and dungeons are a wasted opportunity if it's just furthering the control of high end material.

Raids and dungeons should be something above and beyond, not just a harder version (or the only version) of getting the same high end materials.




I'll offer a couple points that I would suggest incorporating -

1.) Involve overarching story beyond just aliens.

Aliens are a fine start. They're a perfectly safe place to start where you can start establishing a world narrative. PVE should live and breath and reach out as much with its mechanics as it does with the world story. But please, don't just make it aliens.

I'm not your writer but I can imagine dozens of interesting story lines that could utilize your PVE. Do that at every opportunity. Then do it more. This directly feeds the second point -

2.) There need to be more markers of progression and better reasons to PVE.

If there are story reasons for me to be involved in PVE, I am more likely to participate. These need to be backed up with game mechanics.

Further ideas that come to my mind immediately. Unique item mods that players can accumulate to alter the way their items function. Unique armor customization options. Anything unique player customization.

I don't know all the systems you plan to have in the game but depending on those the list is going to be a lot longer if you're creative.

If all you offer are production materials and capped money, most players are not going to give a fuck about your PVE and it's just going to be an avenue glossed over to further PVP.

3.) Raids and dungeons...

It's easy to say raids and dungeons but I am having a hard time picturing it. If it's just something that is a little harder than the regular PVE I think you may be overselling it with the words "raids and dungeons". Why not go big?

Create entirely new planets full of new and more dangerous aliens. Have GMs controlling unique alien characters to fight players with. Do invasion events of existing "safe" territories. Let it all respond to the rise and fall of the story line. The more static your PVE the less compelling it will be to your players. Make it dynamic. Go bigger.

I'd love puzzle based "dungeons" too. Make players work together using their various skills to solve puzzles. Hacking. Combat. Everything. More. Maybe ones you can only solve by getting unique items from certain other aspects of PVE. Make it mesh.



Take that as you will. tl;dr if your PVE is exactly as you described it in the original post I have no personal interest.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TheJoker

BioXide

Founder

Staff member
Lead Developer
Management
Jun 1, 2017
457
Portland, Oregon
Guns of the Conclave
Rank: Princeps (R7)
Service Points: 999999
I can immediately say 1.) I agree, but 2.) I think what you've described is inherently counter intuitive to what you want to achieve.

I agree with: "pve should be fun, engaging & challenging, you should always have access to pve" and "it should be tied to the pvp aspect of the game and "progression" of the factions".

The way you describe your PVE mechanics though sounds like a retread of boring grind mechanics from other games. I'm going to assume you laid out the bare bones in the hopes to hash it out with us so that's where I'm going to give you my opinions.

yes

What exactly do you mean by best equipment?

PVE as described is a means to obtain the highest end materials for the ability to create the highest end production. These areas that provide such materials are going to be PVP hot spots. Someone is going to end up with a majority control. Even if that control changes the entire player pool is never going to be in control if the space is limited. Inevitably, groups of players are going to be locked out of this high end production in at least a limited sense.

there will be multiple open world colonies like necars field that will require vehicles to move around

You say you don't want PVE to change the fact that players are always going to be on the same level but allowing only some players to have the best equipment compared to others sounds to me like the field isn't level. If your only metric of difference is something you can't quantify like "skill" this is bullshit to me.

I doubt that's what you mean. This needs clarification.

You want combat orientated players always having something to meaningfully shoot at for progress.

As a combat orientated player this is how I would view your PVE as described. I have to go to these areas which are more likely than others to have PVP occur which automatically makes them more dangerous than others to me.

As a combat orientated player I can obtain production materials? Why do I want those? If I want to farm materials to turn a profit on I'm not much of a combat focused player. At best I donate them to my faction or a producer I know. My interest levels are low.

or sell them on the market

I'm capped at getting 1-2 hours of money. How much money? Enough that it outweighs the PVP risk of losing my gear trying to get it? Let's say yes. After those 1-2 hours do I care about farming stats? Fuck no. The only stat that ever mattered was penalty points. I would more likely laugh at players that spent all their time farming PVE stats or achievements.

should players be allowed to print unlimited money? thanks for your biased opinion on stats

My ultimate perception is that I don't care about PVE. I'm just going to prey on the players that do and take their shit.

ok

Raids and dungeons are a wasted opportunity if it's just furthering the control of high end material.

Raids and dungeons should be something above and beyond, not just a harder version (or the only version) of getting the same high end materials.

"raids and dungeons", equals non-instanced areas on worlds with high density of difficult enemies


I'll offer a couple points that I would suggest incorporating -

1.) Involve overarching story beyond just aliens.

Aliens are a fine start. They're a perfectly safe place to start where you can start establishing a world narrative. PVE should live and breath and reach out as much with its mechanics as it does with the world story. But please, don't just make it aliens.

I'm not your writer but I can imagine dozens of interesting story lines that could utilize your PVE. Do that at every opportunity. Then do it more. This directly feeds the second point -

we'll have more than just aliens

2.) There need to be more markers of progression and better reasons to PVE.

If there are story reasons for me to be involved in PVE, I am more likely to participate. These need to be backed up with game mechanics.

there will be

Further ideas that come to my mind immediately. Unique item mods that players can accumulate to alter the way their items function. Unique armor customization options. Anything unique player customization.

agreed

I don't know all the systems you plan to have in the game but depending on those the list is going to be a lot longer if you're creative.

there's a lot more

If all you offer are production materials and capped money, most players are not going to give a fuck about your PVE and it's just going to be an avenue glossed over to further PVP.

biased, i would log in just to shoot some AI and get some loot, others will too, i dont want items to drop from AI since I want to keep the economy completely ran by players, we'll probably have pmods drop

3.) "Raids and dungeons..."

It's easy to say raids and dungeons but I am having a hard time picturing it. If it's just something that is a little harder than the regular PVE I think you may be overselling it with the words "raids and dungeons". Why not go big?

Create entirely new planets full of new and more dangerous aliens. Have GMs controlling unique alien characters to fight players with. Do invasion events of existing "safe" territories. Let it all respond to the rise and fall of the story line. The more static your PVE the less compelling it will be to your players. Make it dynamic. Go bigger.

all of that is coming, our storyline gms will have the tools to play as any AI and spawn them, as well as modifying the environment, invasions will be coded on the game and procedural

I'd love puzzle based "dungeons" too. Make players work together using their various skills to solve puzzles. Hacking. Combat. Everything. More. Maybe ones you can only solve by getting unique items from certain other aspects of PVE. Make it mesh.

great idea!

Take that as you will. tl;dr if your PVE is exactly as you described it in the original post I have no personal interest.

"my personal biased goals with pve are the following"

"Those are my thoughts, regarding pve content, coming from a player's perspective and a developer one, I'm interested in seeing what the community thinks about pve content, nothing is set in stone, so let's discuss and pool our thoughts to achieve the best outcome."
Thanks for the ideas!
 

Cadonez

Enthusiast

Bronzed Donator
Alpha Tester
Jul 29, 2017
283
Brumpapa
The Syndicate
Rank: Master (R6)
Service Points: 0
Cathmor is right. Im firmly anti-heavy PVE, but if it exists it should be dynamic and have a draw to people uninterested in pumping bullets into npcs.
 

Cathmor

Citizen

Bronzed Donator
Alpha Tester
Aug 6, 2017
55
No Faction
Rank: None
Service Points: 0
I would never try to convince you that I'm not biased. I am a burnt out MMO player that was spoiled on gems like Asheron's Call and moments of Face of Mankind. Anything I write is personal preference and belief.

Truth be told I wouldn't give players the ability to print money period. Not my game though so I'm going with your vision and offering my opinion as a player that focuses on the combat side of things. Players should not be able to print money. We agree on that.

I would also prefer a closed economy as far as items. You talked about showing off stats though. It would be more interesting if a player that has spent a lot of time hunting aliens would have access to unique ways of showing that off like being able to add cosmetic alien aspects to their armor or weapons. You'd know immediately what this guy is about without having to look something up. That's all I meant by item drops.

Keep in mind too, you've got a lot of players hanging around you that have been burnt by duplex and nexeon. I donated explicitly because I want a good version of FoM to exist and I believe that if it's done right it can succeed. But that doesn't mean I'm going to necessarily trust everything I hear. Hopefully you get that.

I appreciate the clarifications. I like what you added about what we can expect.

But most importantly remove mining guns.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Shakespears