What is the gameplay type of GotC

Meliarion

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But why would the TU be anti merc? The whole government is ran by corporations who use mercs to do combat. I don't get why you're so hellbent on saying the TU will go after mercs as a whole when we simply don't, as long as they stick to their own rules.
Why should they have to rely on the TU (or any other faction) not doing anything stupid rather than having more tools in their toolbox to deal with those situations if they happen? If the playerbase is incapable of negotiating these high level agreements between factional HC then you have more significant issues. Also moving as much stuff as possible from hardcoded to ingame agreements gives much more latitude when it comes to creating the metagame and stories that are needed for this game to work.
 

Banaroth

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While I read the conversation, including the TU issues, my humble reply will be to the original question:

Personally I believe that the roles should be clearly defined, with everything that comes along. Each faction should have a certain risk factor, one way or another. Some depend on other factions, some need to work just inside their own ecosystem, some are focused on selling to earn, etc.

If I like Avalon and I like fighting, I can't demand pvp contracts just because I'd like it.

Planetside 2: Nanite Systems Operatives

It's the 4th "Faction", they are mercenaries, and in order for them to play and fight they JOIN one of the other 3 factions in battles. They have their own colors, their own items, and characters, but they participate ONLY as PART of any of the other factions. NSO PS2 players never demanded their own headquarters, bases, etc. because that's not their ROLE, it's not what they do.

They can't lock in planets and be the winners, they don't get that option because the lore and the role of their organization doesn't include any of the systems that are a given for the rest of the factions. I can't explain it in a more simple way, I ground it down to dust already.

I rest my case.
 

Meliarion

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While I read the conversation, including the TU issues, my humble reply will be to the original question:

Personally I believe that the roles should be clearly defined, with everything that comes along. Each faction should have a certain risk factor, one way or another. Some depend on other factions, some need to work just inside their own ecosystem, some are focused on selling to earn, etc.

If I like Avalon and I like fighting, I can't demand pvp contracts just because I'd like it.
I think there is a disconnect between what the faction should be doing on a day to day level and what the faction should be capable of doing in exceptional circumstances. It is not the job of the CPC to fight wars, should they be mechanically prevented from fighting a war if someone starts a war with the TU?

Also it wouldn't be the first time someone has set up a PMC department inside one of the corps and if the profit is good and the blow back minimal then it is not such a bad idea. Most big contracts take place outside of the contract mechanics, with the money being exchanged upfront and backed by little more than the cell's reputation.

Planetside 2: Nanite Systems Operatives

It's the 4th "Faction", they are mercenaries, and in order for them to play and fight they JOIN one of the other 3 factions in battles. They have their own colors, their own items, and characters, but they participate ONLY as PART of any of the other factions. NSO PS2 players never demanded their own headquarters, bases, etc. because that's not their ROLE, it's not what they do.

They can't lock in planets and be the winners, they don't get that option because the lore and the role of their organization doesn't include any of the systems that are a given for the rest of the factions. I can't explain it in a more simple way, I ground it down to dust already.

I rest my case.
The main difference between this game and Planetside is that the HC functions are all handled by the staff. There is no possibility of the NC and VS forming an alliance against TR. There is no diplomatic and few economic/logistic considerations with the Planetside factions, these are all hard coded into the game mechanics. They just need a reliable stream of enemies to shoot and allies to shoot them with and the NSO fills this game play role but would not work so well in a more dynamic game where allignments are more malleable.
 

Banaroth

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Meliarion

I agree with you mate. I certainly didn't give the PS2 example to make it look like PS2's systems can be totally adapted here, and I definitely don't want to make the life of gotc people miserable.

They should have their own unique ways of profiting and progressing. I was just putting a nail in the coffin of that whole colony, decentralized/or not power in gotc and stuff.

A subject which I was told today has been settled so I hope I didn't add any fuel to any fire by mistake.

GOTC members have the final word, if not the GMs so I'm leaving it up to them. It's definitely a special case, gotc and how they work, but my opinion is kind of irrelevant in the grand scheme of things. I just like balance.
 

Banjo

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But why would the TU be anti merc? The whole government is ran by corporations who use mercs to do combat. I don't get why you're so hellbent on saying the TU will go after mercs as a whole when we simply don't, as long as they stick to their own rules.
There are many reasons why this would be wrong, as from incompetent leaders from either side.
If we want to mechanically shape their playstyle, by changing how their faction can interact with colony ownership, we need to properly support it. As such you can't just mechanically remove unwanted aspects (profit from colony ownership) if you don't also mechanically help them enforce the wanted aspects. So if we want mercs to be able to operate as a union of cells, then we need to enable them to defend that. I think it's a reasonable thought that in order for them to fight back fx corps trying to punish the whole faction for the actions of one cell, they should be able to fight back where it equally hurts the corp, which is their colonies. When this is said it should ofcourse not be encouraged mechanically.
 

JeffDillinger

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There are many reasons why this would be wrong, as from incompetent leaders from either side.
If we want to mechanically shape their playstyle, by changing how their faction can interact with colony ownership, we need to properly support it. As such you can't just mechanically remove unwanted aspects (profit from colony ownership) if you don't also mechanically help them enforce the wanted aspects. So if we want mercs to be able to operate as a union of cells, then we need to enable them to defend that. I think it's a reasonable thought that in order for them to fight back fx corps trying to punish the whole faction for the actions of one cell, they should be able to fight back where it equally hurts the corp, which is their colonies. When this is said it should ofcourse not be encouraged mechanically.
That's why the corruption mechanic is there, at some point it should be so corrupt the corps won't make any money out of it, hence the reason to balance it. When the mercs act as a faction, they're not mercs anymore but generic TDM team grey, which in my opinion ruins their reason for being a faction.

Also, following the reasoning of having bad faction leadership, you assume that GotC will have competent leadership. If we assume they don't have one either, how can we expect them not act like a faction all of the time, since there is hardly incentive as a GotC R7 to decentralize power and give it to the cells.

I'm assuming we'll have at least adults for the HC's so we can at the very least let everyone function to their roles and within that reasoning, I don't feel GotC should be a player in the colony game.
 
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Spark

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Also, following the reasoning of having bad faction leadership, you assume that GotC will have competent leadership.

I'm assuming we'll have at least adults for the HC's so we can at the very least let everyone function to their roles and within that reasoning, I don't feel GotC should be a player in the colony game.
Relax Jeff m8. HC chat is leaking.
 

Banjo

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That's why the corruption mechanic is there, at some point it should be so corrupt the corps won't make any money out of it, hence the reason to balance it. When the mercs act as a faction, they're not mercs anymore but generic TDM team grey, which in my opinion ruins their reason for being a faction.

Also, following the reasoning of having bad faction leadership, you assume that GotC will have competent leadership. If we assume they don't have one either, how can we expect them not act like a faction all of the time, since there is hardly incentive as a GotC R7 to decentralize power and give it to the cells.

I'm assuming we'll have at least adults for the HC's so we can at the very least let everyone function to their roles and within that reasoning, I don't feel GotC should be a player in the colony game.
Assuming that the corruption mechanic is "there", is a bit of a stretch, but in case it was a thing then yes it would save the same purpose. I'm personally more in favour of cadonez interpretation.

I fully expect GotC at some point to be incompetent as is human nature. And we can't expect them to not act like a faction, but at least making their economy not based on colony ownership. As your corruption mechanic does emulate.